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stadium news

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1 stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 10:41 am

Deank

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2 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 10:48 am

EdWin

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I thought the public was consulted already? How many times do we need to consult the public? Too many times, and the NIMBY's will destroy another positive Winnipeg development.

3 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 10:51 am

FlyingRat

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What? Putting up a website and inviting comments is not public consultation? Wink

4 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 10:53 am

Deank

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The public was NEVER consulted about any of these plans. They have held several open houses where they told people what they were going to do but they have not once consulted the public at large with a proper consultation process about if we even wanted a new stadium.


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5 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:19 am

grumpy old man

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Meh. Deank this has been circulating for years. YEARS! EdWin is right. Continued debate merely opens the door for the anti-development, anti-progress, nimby-ers, to rant some more.

There is no location in Winnipeg that everyone will agree with. There is no deal that could be struck that the naysayers would not b1tch about.

And developer would be in a lose-lose proposition. We've debated enough. Build the fricking thing. Get the fricking deal done.


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6 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:25 am

Deank

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WE DONT NEED A NEW ONE!..

1000's of Winnipegers and Manitobans say that. Why is that voice not listened too?

And you right has been circulating for years and yet not once has there been a true public consultation. Why is that?

I do like this idea a little better in that less government money is going into it. BUT I cant stand the fact that it is not in the current stadium location and that current stadium location will be turned into even more retail development in a location that just can absolutely not handle the increased traffic.
And I cant stand the fact that there have been better ideas on the table that were simply discounted for no reason at all other then they did not come from the right person.


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7 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:27 am

FlyingRat

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grumpy old man wrote:Meh. Deank this has been circulating for years. YEARS! EdWin is right. Continued debate merely opens the door for the anti-development, anti-progress, nimby-ers, to rant some more.

There is no location in Winnipeg that everyone will agree with. There is no deal that could be struck that the naysayers would not b1tch about.

And developer would be in a lose-lose proposition. We've debated enough. Build the fricking thing. Get the fricking deal done.

Definitely. This is a great deal for the U of M. It just makes sense from an efficiency point of view to have the Bombers and the Bisons share facilities.

8 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:28 am

grumpy old man

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WE DO NEED A NEW STADIUM.

I can yell too. Smile


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9 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:29 am

FlyingRat

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Deank wrote:WE DONT NEED A NEW ONE!..

1000's of Winnipegers and Manitobans say that. Why is that voice not listened too?

And you right has been circulating for years and yet not once has there been a true public consultation. Why is that?

I do like this idea a little better in that less government money is going into it. BUT I cant stand the fact that it is not in the current stadium location and that current stadium location will be turned into even more retail development in a location that just can absolutely not handle the increased traffic.
And I cant stand the fact that there have been better ideas on the table that were simply discounted for no reason at all other then they did not come from the right person.

Who says there will be increased traffic at a re-purposed stadium site? Will Winnipeggers suddenly have more spending cash? No. Seems more likely there will be the same amount of traffic spread over a larger area.

10 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:30 am

Goth_chic

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I think there are better way to spend that kind of money but whatever. I am not opposed to a new stadium I think Leo's plan was the better one but of course Asker's deal was approved.


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11 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:33 am

casualchris


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Deank wrote:WE DONT NEED A NEW ONE!..

1000's of Winnipegers and Manitobans say that. Why is that voice not listened too?

And you right has been circulating for years and yet not once has there been a true public consultation. Why is that?

I do like this idea a little better in that less government money is going into it. BUT I cant stand the fact that it is not in the current stadium location and that current stadium location will be turned into even more retail development in a location that just can absolutely not handle the increased traffic.
And I cant stand the fact that there have been better ideas on the table that were simply discounted for no reason at all other then they did not come from the right person
.

Dean i often agree with you, but not on this one.

It sounds like the bolded part is more of your issue than a new stadium. Could a new stadium, gast, a covered one do porportionately well as the new arena has?? Could a covered stadium hold other things like large conventions that the convention center is too small for? Could there be box suites or an attached hotel like we're going on about in the 'new mayor' thread? Could we hold the grey cup without having all those sketchy freezing south end seats built and more often because of a higher quality building??

Seems we could use a new one.

12 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:57 am

Deank

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We dont need a new one. Not now. Maybe another 15 years from now. Maybe

If we are building one it should be able to be covered so it can actually be used year round.
If we are building one a proper job of soliciting offers should have been done. Giving the team to someone else to own should NEVER have been on the table.


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13 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 12:26 pm

Deank

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http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/Stadium-announcement-slated-for-1030-am-42321527.html

this is the part I cant understand.

"$26.2 million in new tax revenues,"

how? how is this 26.2 million in new tax?


FYI.. done by 2011 according to the news release


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14 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 12:38 pm

grumpy old man

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Without reading the story I'll speculate the taxes discussed are those generated by the construction of the facility (materials, services, employee taxes...).


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Yes, I really am that Grumpy...

It's their, they're and there; in Canada it's colour, cheque, rumour and zed...

15 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 12:46 pm

Deank

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yeah could be .. I was thinking it meant annual taxes...


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16 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 12:50 pm

grumpy old man

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For those complaining about traffic and parking have ya ever tried to park and get around Polo Park during a Bomber game? That is a real pain for us season ticket holders.

This location has several routes to exit (SB Pembina, NB Pembina, WB Bison Drive). All have significantly greater capacity to move and shed traffic than do the streets around the current stadium location.

Good on everybody that had a hand in this. Enough of the negativism. Move forward or get out of the way...


_________________
Yes, I really am that Grumpy...

It's their, they're and there; in Canada it's colour, cheque, rumour and zed...

17 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 12:59 pm

Bartron

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I'm also a season ticket holder, and we DO need a new stadium. The current one is a dump,very cramped seating and terrible concessions and food options . As gom already stated getting out of the polo park area after a game is a nightmare.

18 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:01 pm

Deank

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thats one of the points its a nightmare all the time.. never mind with even more retail development.. should be made into a nice chunk of green space.


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19 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:06 pm

Triniman

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Deank wrote:WE DONT NEED A NEW ONE!..

1000's of Winnipegers and Manitobans say that. Why is that voice not listened too?

And you right has been circulating for years and yet not once has there been a true public consultation. Why is that?
You are correct. There hasn't been a true public consultation. Why not? Quite simply because our political leaders and the Bombers know that a minority of the citizens actually utilize the Stadium and if there was, say a plebicite, the majority would say NO.
If the private sector were to own the team and build a stadium without tax dollars, ticket prices would have to increase.
In order to keep pro football subsidized by the tax payer, you cannot allow the public to have a formal say or vote.
"Government which governs the least, governs the best." - Thomas Payne.
Canadians are addicted to "big government." Big government wastes huge amounts of money and helps to keep our taxes high, but it also pleases those perpetually on welfare; it keeps the CBC on the air and it keeps the Natives from rioting.



Last edited by Triniman on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:39 pm; edited 1 time in total


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20 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:35 pm

grumpy old man

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Name something that we've built in the last ten years where there has been real public "consultation"? If you want real "consultation" then start demanding plebiscites on such matters.

I can say the majority would have said no to building: the MTS Centre; the Manitoba Hydro Building; the Floodway expansion... Who's to say I'm wrong?

You can't make things up just because they suit your POV.


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Yes, I really am that Grumpy...

It's their, they're and there; in Canada it's colour, cheque, rumour and zed...

21 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:39 pm

Deank

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MTS Centre... I dunnno thats a tough one... Hydro building.. hmm...also tough almost a who cares type one.

Floodway expansion.. another tough one.


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22 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:45 pm

Triniman

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When are plebicites appropriate, in your opinion?
Personally, I'm not opposed to a new stadium, especially since I live not too far from the U of M and will enjoy a shorter communte to get to it.
Politicians are very clever. Doer is a huge football fan. Do you really think he would jeopardize the prospect of getting newer digs by supporting a plebicite for something that a minority of the public uses? No way in hell.
Power is the ability to get the tax payer to subsidize the recreational interests of a minority. Let's keep the natives on welfare while were at it.


_________________
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through
our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that
democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'



― Isaac Asimov

23 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:49 pm

Triniman

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Deank wrote:MTS Centre... I dunnno thats a tough one... Hydro building.. hmm...also tough almost a who cares type one.

Floodway expansion.. another tough one.
Unless I'm mistaken, the MTS Centre has long paid back in taxes the tax dollars that went into it. Now, government can say that the MTS Centre has increased the tax base.
Ten or 12 home games a year can't make pro football stand on its own two feet with the taxpayer subsidizing it. User pay? No way! Make the public pay! That's the fair way of doing things.


_________________
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through
our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that
democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'



― Isaac Asimov

24 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:50 pm

grumpy old man

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When are plebiscites appropriate, in your opinion?

Who knows? I'm suggesting plebiscites to shut the naysayers up. I'm sick of people making comments that can't be supported.

That said Winnipeggers have a propensity to dismiss almost everything even remotely progressive. How in God's name did we become this way?


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Yes, I really am that Grumpy...

It's their, they're and there; in Canada it's colour, cheque, rumour and zed...

25 Re: stadium news on Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:53 pm

Deank

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grumpy old man wrote:
When are plebiscites appropriate, in your opinion?

Who knows? I'm suggesting plebiscites to shut the naysayers up. I'm sick of people making comments that can't be supported.

That said Winnipeggers have a propensity to dismiss almost everything even remotely progressive. How in God's name did we become this way?

too many years under the steel toed boot of communist dictators?

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