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Museum finally admits it needs to raise more money priovately.

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justmythoughts



Why is anyone blaming the Aspers when this is a federal, provincial and City project?

What is the matter with you ?

This was pitched to the 3 levels of government and was accepted by the 3 levels of government.

Yes it was accepted by all 3 levels of government. All 3 levels of government have lived up to their respective promised financial commitments in regards to the CMHR.

You want to place blame? Look no further to Gail Asper and her "Friends" who vowed to the Senate committee up down and sideways that they and only they would cover any and all cost over-runs.
They even vowed to have a contingency fund in place to pay for any over-runs.

Government delivered to the CMHR what was promised. Now it's up to Gail and her "Friends".

Stonekiller

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So what is the solution? Continue to fund raise, get the museum built, and accept that this type of funding/donation model is useless if the team drafting the project can't honestly provide true financial requirements.

The only thing that really bothers me about this whole project is that they had to of known what the costs were going to be. Why lie about them. The people of this country would probably be more open to financing a project that is guaranteed to meet its budget on time, and without having to go back with hat in hand begging for more.

Triniman

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But, Mr. Premier (Prime Minister, Mayor, etc.); you can't possibly not donate more money, with the museum being so close to being finished.

Thankfully, that tactic has failed.

For a project that is supposed to help "advance humanity forward," the wealthy seem awfully disinterested in chipping in.


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our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that
democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'



― Isaac Asimov

justmythoughts

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Unless Selinger steps up to the plate (which for some reason I think IS going to happen) all they can do is fundraise. But I also think the increasing costs (inflation / materials etc.) will outstrip the level of private fundraising.

I also believe they never had a clue how and where costs were going to rise... the elitist brain trust that are the "Friends" just wanted the thing built to appease their egos, thinking all along that either their project was so important that private donations would far exceed expectations or that government would bail them out in perpetuity.

What they probably should have done is get funding fully in place and then with all 265m or 310M in the bank perhaps being invested and gaining interest, tenders for construction should then have been sent out and work should have only then commenced.

310M would easily have accrued 10M in interest annually would could have been used as a contingency for any cost over-runs.

Deank

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They LIED to the Senate. Pretty sure thats a crime.

book em Dano


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rosencrentz

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You guys have to donate, otherwise I won't get to make sofas for the lounge area! Come on !!


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Outsider

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Stonekiller wrote:
The only thing that really bothers me about this whole project is that they had to of known what the costs were going to be. Why lie about them. The people of this country would probably be more open to financing a project that is guaranteed to meet its budget on time, and without having to go back with hat in hand begging for more.
Maybe they really did not know what the real costs would be when the project was first conceived. Maybe they were hit by "scope creep".
.

Outsider

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rosencrentz wrote:You guys have to donate, otherwise I won't get to make sofas for the lounge area! Come on !!
I thought you already made them.

By the way some gentleman named Rosen wrote an interesting letter to the editor in the F.P about the Rapid Transit System.
Any relation to you?

Deank

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heh.. cant be two people like rosie on our planet can there??


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Outsider

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Stonekiller wrote:Realistically the money has to come from somewhere, the thing can't sit there unfinished. Failure at this point isn't an option.
Why isn't not finishing the building an option?

Triniman

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It's entirely possible that some of these top 60 richest Canadians have not donated as much as they could, if any. They are worth $160 billion.

Why aren't they interested? No one cares why the average joe isn't interested, but these are among the most influential people in Canada. They could easily cover all funds needed. But they aren't. Why?


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“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through
our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that
democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'



― Isaac Asimov

Deank

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Perhaps because they did not get rich by being stupid or associating their names with suspect causes?


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rosencrentz

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A $400 million dollar Museum all about Man's inhumanity to Man, has to be the stupidest Museum ever!

For $2 you could buy todays Globe and Mail, or better yet online and for free any one of a dozen newspapers and in the newspapers in the last week thre are 29 stories in which someone has killed 16, 1, 7, 4, 2, 3, 9, 53, 12, 4 , 3,1, 2, 21, children, women, boys, girls and a few men, because they did not believe in my religion!

What a horrible waste of money, but I am glad that since the decision was made to spend the money , that it is being spent in Winnipeg!

Our 1st World Class Building and it is making the people in Toronto so very envious! Too bad we won't be able to finish it ! That is embarassing!

WORLD CLASS EMBARASSMENT!


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Stonekiller

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Outsider wrote:
Stonekiller wrote:Realistically the money has to come from somewhere, the thing can't sit there unfinished. Failure at this point isn't an option.
Why isn't not finishing the building an option?

By not finishing the building it will be a complete waste of money and resources. Not to mention a colossal embarrassment for the city, the province, and the feds. If it were merely a hole in the ground with some cement pilings then sure not a big deal. But we have a nearly complete structure, which is pretty prominent in the Winnipeg skyline now.

But yeah letting it be not finished that must be a good idea right? Rolling Eyes

justmythoughts

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Stonekiller wrote:
Outsider wrote:
Stonekiller wrote:Realistically the money has to come from somewhere, the thing can't sit there unfinished. Failure at this point isn't an option.
Why isn't not finishing the building an option?

By not finishing the building it will be a complete waste of money and resources. Not to mention a colossal embarrassment for the city, the province, and the feds. If it were merely a hole in the ground with some cement pilings then sure not a big deal. But we have a nearly complete structure, which is pretty prominent in the Winnipeg skyline now.

But yeah letting it be not finished that must be a good idea right? Rolling Eyes


This is exactly what Ms. Asper is relying on. She makes a big splash announcing a renewed effort to raise another 50M+ knowing full well the chances of doing so are next to nil barring they find a lender willing to take the gamble of lifetime.

She plods along with the media following each new nickel raised hoping the governments will be shamed into writing her the proverbial blank cheque. Knowing full well the the longer it takes for the private sector to "come thru" the higher the cost rise putting pressure on government to bail her out before the price hits 500M.

There you have it... shaming government into giving more $$$.

In my opinion she is playing a dangerous game of chicken with government...... however... Selinger will blink first.

Deank

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but but but... they said they have enough money to finish everything....


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Stonekiller

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Uggg... Even if Gail admitted that this was the intent all along, it still needs to be finished. To not finish it now would be literally tossing the money already spent down the toilet. The government does enough of that already.

However moving forward, this project should be the example that future projects used as an example of what not to do.

Outsider

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Why can't it be left unfinished right where it is.
Couldn't the Federal government start saving approximately $22 million per year almost immediately just on the annul museum funding?
And the unfinished museum could serve as a living case study on what can happen when a project does not get its finances in order before it starts. It can also show what happens if a project takes on "scope-creep".

grumpy old man

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Seriously?

Will the $130 million be returned to the people that donated it?

Or let this be a lesson learned?


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Outsider

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grumpy old man wrote:Seriously?

Will the $130 million be returned to the people that donated it?

Or let this be a lesson learned?

Yes, I am serious.
How much of that $130 million has actually been received?
Or was it promised to be donated over a certain number of years?

grumpy old man

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Lets assume 75% (I have no idea). Will any donation be returned or will it be tough noogies? If the money is returned who is on the hook to pay it back?


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rosencrentz

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I saw an article that said the Museum had 4 football fields of space- 2 problems solved!

The football fans can take an egg crate to sit on, there is ample parking for football and the remaining space will work as a down sized Musem!


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justmythoughts

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Here's a novel idea. Harper gives them the 60M or so they need to finish construction. In exchange, operating expenses are reduced to zero for the next 3 years.

The "Friends" continue to raise cash towards the operating expenses only. We sit back and watch just how quickly we learn that it doesn't take anywhere near 22M to operate a museum that won't be open for 3 years.

Gail surely has some accounting friends who'll determine they can "operate" with maybe 8M a year until the place opens. Cut salaries by 50% and bang... 3M saved without blinking an eye.

grumpy old man

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That's actually a great idea!


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Yes, I really am that Grumpy...

It's their, they're and there; in Canada it's colour, cheque, rumour and zed...

Deank

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um... they actually pretty much do that already. They have been "borrowing" against the 22 million operating for construction quite regularly if Iam reading the budget information correctly.


and dont forget.. they already have 57 full time employees.... for what.?? I dont really know.. maybe for cicrle jerk off parties.. but regardless they have a fair amount of operating revenue already.


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justmythoughts

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Deank wrote:um... they actually pretty much do that already. They have been "borrowing" against the 22 million operating for construction quite regularly if Iam reading the budget information correctly.


and dont forget.. they already have 57 full time employees.... for what.?? I dont really know.. maybe for cicrle jerk off parties.. but regardless they have a fair amount of operating revenue already.

had no clue they've been borrowing against operating costs for construction. guess the Freep missed that.

Five HR managers to oversee a circle jerk? Who knew? lol!

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