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won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz!

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101 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:47 pm

USApegger


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From Kives twitter: Havixbeck said she believes Canalta deal is dead. Said company won't want to spend $200K on designs, plans & consultations.

I see, so we were supposed to just take their word for it that it would all be okie dokie?

102 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:48 pm

AGEsAces

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Deank wrote:"I'm not sure what Sammy was crying about for parking though. I thought
part of the plan was to have a multi-level parkade included? Or was
that something I misheard?"

Sammy never started crying until there was massive public backlash and all of a sudden (in less then 24 hours from one statement to the next) "he was advised that for legal reasons he should recuse himself"

No, I heard the day they announced the waterpark that Sammy was crying that the parking lot would be lost...and "where would people park for Goldeyes games?"

But then recused himself of later due to possible conflict.

But my point there was...I thought a parkade was part of the original plan? Though not till phase 2 or 3?

http://www.photage.ca

103 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:50 pm

AGEsAces

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USApegger wrote:Wow, that idiot Swandel just said something along the lines of the council should show respect to Canalta and give them time to present their plans, renederings etc.

So, Swandel sits on EPC, votes this thing to move forward for a fast approval in council and when it doesn't happen he says we need to respect Canalta, the company that is taking 7 million of taxpayer moeny??

Well...to be fair there..I'm not listening/watching...but I think the committee should have to at least "hear/see" the plans if CanALTA is ready to present them. But I think any group that's ready to present something and has made it to committee should be heard too.

http://www.photage.ca

104 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:56 pm

grumpy old man

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I believe the whole problem with the proposal put forward was the complete lack of details, including what the hotel would look like and the branding of the hotel. Ditto the water park aspect of it.

This is just the wrong place for the water park.


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105 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:03 pm

Deank

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AGEsAces wrote:
Deank wrote:"I'm not sure what Sammy was crying about for parking though. I thought
part of the plan was to have a multi-level parkade included? Or was
that something I misheard?"

Sammy never started crying until there was massive public backlash and all of a sudden (in less then 24 hours from one statement to the next) "he was advised that for legal reasons he should recuse himself"

No, I heard the day they announced the waterpark that Sammy was crying that the parking lot would be lost...and "where would people park for Goldeyes games?"

But then recused himself of later due to possible conflict.

But my point there was...I thought a parkade was part of the original plan? Though not till phase 2 or 3?
he was definitely not bemoaning the loss of parking on day 1


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106 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:04 pm

Deank

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"..but I think the committee should have to at least "hear/see" the plans if CanALTA is ready to present them."

There are not plans to see.


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107 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:07 pm

justmythoughts

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I had no idea Havixbeck was such an complete idiot.

bkives: Havixbeck said she believes Canalta deal is dead. Said company won't want to spend $200K on designs, plans & consultations

So Canalta wants to spend 75M to build this thing but paying another 200K so the city can do it's proper due diligence... "will kill the deal" according to Paula.

Tells me all I need to know about Canalta... if what Paula said is true.

108 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:12 pm

Deank

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Easy solution.

City grants them a 200K tax deduction to repay the costs if the design ends up being good enough to pass when it does come to council


also.. yeah.. 75 million they will spend and they wont spend 200k to make sure its done?
I am fairly sure some of these peeps have been at business lunches that cost close to that amount.


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109 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:28 pm

USApegger

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I am extremely disappointed with Katz over this entire thing. I think he must shake about the EPC, demote Swandel, Paula and (they are just a bunch of artsie fartsies Wyatt)

110 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:38 pm

Deank

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nah. There will be a shake up.. but not like you are thinking.


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111 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:23 am

LivingDead

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SAM, Fix the roads and repair our crumbling infrastructure Take that 7 million and reduce my taxes or start fixing broken stuff.


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112 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 9:54 am

justmythoughts

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The Black Rod really put this whole water park fiasco on the table. Shame not everyone will get a chance to read it.

The 700K for the "poor" to use the water park is intended to be distributed with 20,000 passes per year. The works out to $35.00 a pop. The park in GF only charges $16.00. Can't see many locals forking over $35.00 for this "park" that's only going to be slight bigger.

More fun can be read here.

http://blackrod.blogspot.ca/

113 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 9:59 am

Deank

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"The 700K for the "poor" to use the water park is intended to be
distributed with 20,000 passes per year. The works out to $35.00 a pop.
The park in GF only charges $16.00. Can't see many locals forking
over $35.00 for this "park" that's only going to be slight bigger."

all points I raised in the freep comment section.


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114 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 10:36 am

grumpy old man

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What is the black rod going on about with regards to the location? As far as I'm concerned that WHOLE area is the Forks.

That's about all that "controversy" is worth...


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Yes, I really am that Grumpy...

It's their, they're and there; in Canada it's colour, cheque, rumour and zed...

115 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 11:08 am

Deank

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meh.. it all stems from one of the EPC people saying.. ITS NOT THE FORKS!!!! at EPC.. and then other people saying.. well it obviously is the forks because its part of the Forks management area.

hell the Museum is at the forks... http://humanrightsmuseum.ca/building-museum/-museum-detail

so how exactly is this not?

I call issue with black rods interpretation of the forks as the area he shades in blue. Well if you really want to get technical.. its actually just the part where the rivers meet so his argument is then out the window too.

him including that little bit in his argument is moronic at best, and at worst.. included as some form of deception.


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116 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 11:29 am

Hollywood

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The Black Rod covered it all. I recommend the history of the bidding process on water parks. Reading it makes me cringe. Why on Earth we see the need to politicize porivate developments is beyond me. It seems all developers want to ensure that if their project is built then nobody else's will be.

Here are the highlights:

...


But after a personal request from a trusted reader to try and make sense
out of the mess, we started collecting info. Then, on the weekend, the
debate lurched from farce into delusion, and we couldn't turn away
from the train wreck they call City Hall.

So....in no particular order, here's what we uncovered:

* the land in question is nowhere near The Forks (or what everybody knows to be The Forks)

* CentreVenture may have kiboshed an offer of a better water park three years ago

* Admission to the proposed water park would be $35 a head, for children at least

* They call it " one of the most valuable pieces of publicly owned
property in Winnipeg", but we're paying a million dollars to a
developer to take it off our hands

* The Winnipeg Free Press continues to rewrite history as far as the Aspers are concerned.

...


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117 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 11:53 am

Deank

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I read all that and talked about it online when it happened. Wink.


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118 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 1:34 pm

rosencrentz

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Where is a $35 entrance fee discussed? I don't believe that any one will pay $35 for a waterslide!


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119 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 1:40 pm

rosencrentz

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Why do we automatically blame Katz, when he has 1 vote out of 15?

Here is a good thing that has happened, $965,000 available for renovations to Community Centres, this year, with a maximum of $50,000 per Centre.

WOW, isn't Mayor Katz wonderful?


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120 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 3:01 pm

justmythoughts

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rosencrentz wrote:Where is a $35 entrance fee discussed? I don't believe that any one will pay $35 for a waterslide!

20,000 "free" passes valued at 700K.... $35.00 each straight from my calculator.

121 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 4:15 pm

Stonekiller

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Could that be a family pass? That would seem likely unless it was indicated otherwise.

122 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Wed May 02, 2012 4:23 pm

Deank

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no one knows since no details were given out. All we can do is guess.


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123 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Thu May 03, 2012 9:08 am

Freeman

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So, why is the city involved in this anyway? Are they hotel experts? Are they waterpark experts?



If someone thinks that a waterpark is a good business venture, then let them go to it. If they need public money, then I guess it isn't a good deal, so don't do it.



Every time theres an idea or a discussion about some new venture in this city, the cry goes out about the "less fortunate." How about they get a job at the hotel or waterpark or whatever, then they can pay the price of admission.



Such is the world.

124 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Thu May 03, 2012 9:17 am

Outsider

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Freeman wrote:So, why is the city involved in this anyway?
.

I am confused.
On one hand it seems the city is trying to get out of the golf course business which is recreation.

On the other hand they seem to want to get into the waterpark business which is also recreation. scratch

125 Re: won't someone PLEASE think of Sam Katz! on Thu May 03, 2012 9:36 am

Freeman

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Precisely, and millions still gets pumped into an outdated and inadequate community centre system, but public funding is needed for a waterpark. What next?



Does anyone think that the city has the expertise in any of these enterprises? If they do, then those folks should quit their high paying city jobs, which provide for no layoffs, massive benefits, and a fully indexed defined benefit pension with a generous early retirement option and go into the private sector and run one? (did I just say something funny?)

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